Aesthetics

[abknight@zzzzzz]

I want to send in a late judgement about the debate on the
aesthetic intentions of Marcel Ducamp.  In the match of
Clive vs Bill I pronounce Bill the victor.  As far as my
entering the ring, well, I couldn't  find the arena, and
well, at this point everyone has gone home.

This is an exerpt from an Arthur Danto article with quotes
 from Duchamp about his intentions with the ready-mades:

"This overcoming of taste was the achievement of his
readymades of 1915-1917, intended to exemplify the most
radical dissociation of aesthetics from art. "A point
which I very much want to establish is that the choice of
these 'readymades' was never dictated by aesthetic
delectation," Duchamp wrote, retrospectively in 1961. "The
choice was based on a reaction of visual indifference with
at the same time a total absence of good or bad taste...in
fact a complete anesthesia."(18) In 1924, Duchamp made it
clear that finding an object with no aesthetic qualities
was far from simple, but we can get a sense for his
intention if we consider his Comb...."

I believe Clive had felt that Duchamp found the
ready-mades attractive in an art and crafts, industrial
way.
I had impuned Duchamp with an opposite emotion of embrace
of the displeasing.   Way off the map.  Bill, I believe
pretty well got Duchamp right to a word when saying that
his purpose was to remove aesthetics from sculpture.  Now
is Clive right that the eternal overturn of accepted norms
always bends our minds to find them beautiful?   That for
example, the brutalist architecture of the 70's will
eventually become decorated with an ivy of affection?   To
suggestible minds like mine, always!

Clive perhaps you are talking of something like
aesthetics, but not exactly aesthetics.  Aesthetics with
the part about beauty removed is hardly aesthetics
anymore.  But perhaps you are talking of a valuation based
on something besides beauty.  Perhaps meaning.  I think it
was Duchamp's hope to replace aesthetics with meaning.

I must continue my education,

http://www.toutfait.com/issues/issue_3/News/Danto/danto.html

Bill